• Advertisement

4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Discuss all things related to 4x4, Isuzu's and anything else related to getting out and about

4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Thu Jul 12, 2012 5:23 am

Hi everyone,

I'm from Canada and looking to purchase either a 4jg2t or 4jb1t to put in a 1993 jeep cherokee. The cherokee weighs about 3000 lbs and the automatic transmission offered is the AW4 which I believe is the same automatic offered with the bighorn 3.1l (aw 30-40). At first I was considering this swap combo since the 4jg2 can be found with transmission and and transfercase for around $2500.

Now after reading more and more I am considering the 4jb1t. Reasons for this are: Direct injection so in cold weather where I live it should start nice, from what I have read better fuel economy, and some come with a gear driven setup as opposed to belts.

The negatives to this motor as far as I can tell are: its older, parts can be harder to find here. And for swapping into a vehicle here in Canada, the motor needs to be newer than the vehicle for it to be considered legal.

A primary motivator for this build is for a fun project and for fuel economy so I can drive back and forth between provinces.

So, from what I have read the 2.8l with a manual will give me the best mileage, with the 3.1l manual not far behind. ( on a side not... I probably will run about a 31" tire and regear the jeep if necessary).

I hear the autos seem to suck the power and economy from the motors, but in many ways I think I would prefer an auto.

So basically I'm looking for opinions on which combo to choose and why for some insight to things I have not thought of.

I really appreciate any responses Thank you.
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby stardog » Thu Jul 12, 2012 7:27 am

I have seen it done but the jeep had a 3.9 isuzu none turbo engine a while back but the guy sold it. If i was going to do it which i have been thinking about for a while i would be dropping the intercooled 3.1 manual in the cherokee.
The cherokee what fun it would bee then they have the 4 litre petrol motors in them over here and are thirsty on fuel but are great out 4x4 in the bush when set up right.
stardog
Isuzu Guru
 
Posts: 625
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:14 pm
Location: sydney nsw australia
Age: 50
Country: australia
City: sydney
Vehicle: 94 mu was 3.1 turbo intercooled now 2.8td rodeo gear drive engine and intercooled and fuel delivery turned up 3" system from turbo 5 speed manual arb bullbar 13000 LB winch max winch snorkel HID headlights HID IPF spotlights blue led dash lights LOKKA front diff new bushes shocks all round 80 ch unden uhf sony xplode mp3 player back seats removed and storge system put in.

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:14 am

Thank you for your reply. The fuel consumption of many gas motors out here is rediculous, can hardly afford to run them. I would like to be able to get about 8 or 9L/100 km. Is this a reasonable goal for a vehicle of this weight and a 3.1l manual?
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby stardog » Thu Jul 12, 2012 12:45 pm

Just came across this about the converting to a diesel most people are using cummings engines but this 1 is for a isuzu.
http://www.canev.com/Jeep.html
I think this might help you out a bit.
stardog
Isuzu Guru
 
Posts: 625
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:14 pm
Location: sydney nsw australia
Age: 50
Country: australia
City: sydney
Vehicle: 94 mu was 3.1 turbo intercooled now 2.8td rodeo gear drive engine and intercooled and fuel delivery turned up 3" system from turbo 5 speed manual arb bullbar 13000 LB winch max winch snorkel HID headlights HID IPF spotlights blue led dash lights LOKKA front diff new bushes shocks all round 80 ch unden uhf sony xplode mp3 player back seats removed and storge system put in.

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Thu Jul 12, 2012 3:03 pm

Yes I have seen this page before. Thank you for posting it. It sounds like he has gotten great results and I hope I can produce similar ones. The Cherokee his engine went in should be about 700lbs heavier than the model I am planning on installing the motor in. So maybe if I'm lucky I can get a bit better economy than him. I wonder how easy it is to bolt the 4jg2 to the AX 15 transmission. Looks like all he needed was a simple aluminium spacer (I'm assuming) with a bellhousing. One thing I am uncertain on is what flywheel/pressure plate/clutch setup I should be using any insight into that? (I have never worked on a vehicle with a manual transmission so a lot of this is fairly new to me)

Thanks again
Chris
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby stardog » Thu Jul 12, 2012 3:50 pm

I think the easy way would get the isuzu engine and gearbox together and drop them into it. But the front drive shaft from the transfer case sits on right hand side under the drivers side or over your way the passenger side if as if i remember right your cars are left hand drives.
You could talk to the guy on the site and ask him about the bell housing adapter and clutch set up that he done.
stardog
Isuzu Guru
 
Posts: 625
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:14 pm
Location: sydney nsw australia
Age: 50
Country: australia
City: sydney
Vehicle: 94 mu was 3.1 turbo intercooled now 2.8td rodeo gear drive engine and intercooled and fuel delivery turned up 3" system from turbo 5 speed manual arb bullbar 13000 LB winch max winch snorkel HID headlights HID IPF spotlights blue led dash lights LOKKA front diff new bushes shocks all round 80 ch unden uhf sony xplode mp3 player back seats removed and storge system put in.

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby geeves » Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:00 pm

I would like to be able to get about 8 or 9L/100 km

of the 2 engines the 4jb1 might even do better than 8 in a cherokee the 4jg2 will be around 9 or slightly over. In my bighorn which is pushing 4000 pounds and a more shed like in shape will do 8.3 l/100km at an average speed of 100kph but that is on a manual trans. Both engines are available with the auto trans and looking at my book it should have a separate bellhousing. If this is the case then taking the isuzu bellhousing and bolting it to your auto will save a lot of headaches.
The 4jb1 was sold in the utes in some markets up to about 98 so a later motor should be available but how to verify the year of the engine I dont know. Licensed copies of this engine are still made in China and Brazil.
Another option is the 4ja1 engine This is only 2.5l but much the same horsepower and similar economy to the 4jb1 It was also sold in USA in some vehicles. It was a new engine in the late 90s so it must meet the rules
Dont ask me Im only the admin
User avatar
geeves
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6859
Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 1:36 pm
Location: wellington
Age: 53
Country: NZ
City: Wellington
Vehicle: 89 bighorn
96 wizard

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Fri Jul 13, 2012 5:38 am

stardog wrote:I think the easy way would get the isuzu engine and gearbox together and drop them into it. But the front drive shaft from the transfer case sits on right hand side under the drivers side or over your way the passenger side if as if i remember right your cars are left hand drives.
You could talk to the guy on the site and ask him about the bell housing adapter and clutch set up that he done.


Yes dropping in this combo would be very easy and if the output shaft (21 or 23 spline in north america) and bolt pattern on the back of the transmission are the same as the version sold here (that came in the cherokee) I should be able to swap the transfercase for the correct side differential.

geeves wrote:I would like to be able to get about 8 or 9L/100 km

of the 2 engines the 4jb1 might even do better than 8 in a cherokee the 4jg2 will be around 9 or slightly over. In my bighorn which is pushing 4000 pounds and a more shed like in shape will do 8.3 l/100km at an average speed of 100kph but that is on a manual trans. Both engines are available with the auto trans and looking at my book it should have a separate bellhousing. If this is the case then taking the isuzu bellhousing and bolting it to your auto will save a lot of headaches.
The 4jb1 was sold in the utes in some markets up to about 98 so a later motor should be available but how to verify the year of the engine I dont know. Licensed copies of this engine are still made in China and Brazil.
Another option is the 4ja1 engine This is only 2.5l but much the same horsepower and similar economy to the 4jb1 It was also sold in USA in some vehicles. It was a new engine in the late 90s so it must meet the rules


One of the more important aspects of this swap to me is the fuel economy. I am not in much of a rush to complete this project. I must say that 8l/100km would be fantastic.

The manual transmissions offered with the 2.8l and 3.1l diesels are made by aisin (MUA5) which shares the same bolt pattern as the AX15 found in jeep cherokees. If I could find a 2.8l diesel with a manual attached I may be able to use the bellhousing and flywheel from that transmission to adapt the AX15 transmission.

Out of curiosity, do you know/heard of anyone using a licensed copy of one of these engines?
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby slightlydodgy » Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:00 am

Just to throw a spanner in your works the bell housing on the MUA5 isn't removable or interchangable
Tremble With Fear I've Just Had an Idea

Image
User avatar
slightlydodgy
Global Moderator
 
Posts: 724
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:08 pm
Location: Taranaki
Age: 39
Country: New Zealand
City: Opunake
Vehicle: Missing my 1990 2.6 petrol crew cab rodeo 50mm body lift, 45mm engine and box lift, heavy duty springs, 75mm suspension lift, 32 x 11.5 dueler mts and front bar and snorkel by slightlydodgy Currently Isuzuless

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:58 am

slightlydodgy wrote:Just to throw a spanner in your works the bell housing on the MUA5 isn't removable or interchangable


Haha that's going to slow this down abit.
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby geeves » Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:54 am

the bellhousing on the auto apears to be though
Dont ask me Im only the admin
User avatar
geeves
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6859
Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 1:36 pm
Location: wellington
Age: 53
Country: NZ
City: Wellington
Vehicle: 89 bighorn
96 wizard

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby stardog » Fri Jul 13, 2012 10:51 am

Read this thread.
http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthrea ... lease-help
It seems quiet common in phillipines using 4jb1t and AX15 transmission together to repower cherokees over there.
stardog
Isuzu Guru
 
Posts: 625
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2009 6:14 pm
Location: sydney nsw australia
Age: 50
Country: australia
City: sydney
Vehicle: 94 mu was 3.1 turbo intercooled now 2.8td rodeo gear drive engine and intercooled and fuel delivery turned up 3" system from turbo 5 speed manual arb bullbar 13000 LB winch max winch snorkel HID headlights HID IPF spotlights blue led dash lights LOKKA front diff new bushes shocks all round 80 ch unden uhf sony xplode mp3 player back seats removed and storge system put in.

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:44 am

geeves wrote:the bellhousing on the auto apears to be though


Yes I believe that is correct. I wonder if something like that could be modified to work....

stardog wrote:Read this thread.
http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/showthrea ... lease-help
It seems quiet common in phillipines using 4jb1t and AX15 transmission together to repower cherokees over there.


That's interesting... Maybe I'll resurect that thread see if there is more info to be found
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:50 am

With all that extra work gotta wonder if it's worth an extra 2l/100km possibly a difference of about $20 per tank for the same distance....
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby geeves » Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:02 pm

2l/100km ?
The petrol jeeps over here average 17mpg or about 16l/100km
Even with Americam gas prices thats lots more than 20 bucks a tank
Dont ask me Im only the admin
User avatar
geeves
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6859
Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 1:36 pm
Location: wellington
Age: 53
Country: NZ
City: Wellington
Vehicle: 89 bighorn
96 wizard

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:12 pm

geeves wrote:2l/100km ?
The petrol jeeps over here average 17mpg or about 16l/100km
Even with Americam gas prices thats lots more than 20 bucks a tank


I did not clarify. I mean between the 4jb1t and 4jg2t manual/auto gains lol. I curently drive a dodge dakota and get 20l/100km. Hurts the wallet a lot.
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby geeves » Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:38 pm

I have a early bighorn/trooper with a 4jb1 and manual and a wizard/rodeo with 4jg2 and auto. The wizard is 7 years younger and far nicer to drive but the difference means getting 600km to 700km to a tank instead of 700 to 900km in the Bighorn. The auto and extra weight pretty much eats all the power difference although the 4jb1 is running extra boost. The bighorn is noisy due to no carpets and has all the wrinkles you would expect from being used offroad for 16 years. Its no longer a pretty car
Dont ask me Im only the admin
User avatar
geeves
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6859
Joined: Sun May 10, 2009 1:36 pm
Location: wellington
Age: 53
Country: NZ
City: Wellington
Vehicle: 89 bighorn
96 wizard

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:48 pm

geeves wrote:I have a early bighorn/trooper with a 4jb1 and manual and a wizard/rodeo with 4jg2 and auto. The wizard is 7 years younger and far nicer to drive but the difference means getting 600km to 700km to a tank instead of 700 to 900km in the Bighorn. The auto and extra weight pretty much eats all the power difference although the 4jb1 is running extra boost. The bighorn is noisy due to no carpets and has all the wrinkles you would expect from being used offroad for 16 years. Its no longer a pretty car


Well that settles it. It's going to be a 4jb1t and 5 speed manual. Since its going to be a engine older than the vehicle maybe I'll spring for a bit of a newer Cherokee like a 98. Reasonably newer
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:24 am

Well I think the easiest way to proceed with bolting the AX15 to either the 4jb1t or 4jg2t would be to either dill out holes on the motor plate if it is large enough to accommodate the ax15 bellhousing or to fab a new plate up.

Other than ensuring everything is perfectly lined up, and to correct depths, I don't believe this will be to difficult of a task, just time consuming.

Image
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Re: 4jb1t or 4jg2t into jeep cherokee

Postby chriskasian » Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:25 pm

So out of curiosity, has anyone heard anything about these chinesse copies of the 4jb1t? I have been emailing a company and they want about 2700 YAUN per engine, so around $500 Canadian. Engine crate is only 0.52m^3 so shouldnt be to much for shipping lol. Has anyone ever heard of one of these things running? From the amount of money these companies make, these copies must be used in china and other places......

http://kaijiauto.en.alibaba.com/product/295687575-200221770/4JB1T_diesel_engine.html?edm_src=sys&edm_type=fdbk&edm_grp=0&edm_cta=read_msg&edm_time=realtime&edm_ver=e
chriskasian
Isuzu Baby
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:21 am
Age: 25
Country: canada
City: somewhere
Vehicle: In the near future... jeep Cherokee 4jb1t

Next

Return to General Isuzu and 4x4 discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], iananita and 1 guest